Or will it be just the buyer at risk because it was the buyer's decision or idea? certification and affirmation under penalty of perjury and I For more information, visit the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia. I am selling my car, and I had a guy that offered 16,500. I don't know how vigorously they investigated, maybe it's an easy crime to get away with. Do I need my own attorney during mortgage refinancing? This is highly illegal. Copyright © 1995-2020  |  FreeAdvice.com  |  15310 Amberly Dr, Suite 250, Tampa, FL 33647  |  Privacy Policy  |  Terms & Conditions  |  CCPA. Helps the DMV calculate fees. The buyer for our car wants us to write a bill of sale for a $1000 less than the sell price and give us $1000 cash for the balance. Capital gains is typically going to be much higher than sales tax. Tiny variations in the facts, or a fact not set forth in a question, often can change a legal outcome Chris W. Rea. I've never sold a car before, but I'm guessing that's for tax purposes. Pennsylvania real estate - buyer agency contract, Itemizing deductions: Proportional tax paid for vehicle title and registration that is not sales tax. We definitly know that we put the full sales price of $3400 on the Bill of Sale as well as on the back of the Title when we signed it. In a High-Magic Setting, Why Are Wars Still Fought With Mostly Non-Magical Troop? "My buddy Frank suggested that he and I rob a bank, so I went along, I shot the guard and drove the getaway car while Frank was the one who grabbed the money. But when the bill of sale arrived, you’re shocked at the total price. When my uncle went to register the car the clerk questioned the price listed on the bill of sale. If you buy a $10,000 car for $1000, the DMV is going to immediately notice that fair market value wasn't paid and you'll get caught. Virginia uses more words: In accordance with all applicable statutes, administrative rules and Going along with a bad/criminal idea just because it was not YOUR idea is not a valid defense when the law eventually comes knocking on your door... @gnasher729 well, this doesn't make sense: if he pays cash, he can't prove it. Once, selling vehicle to a friend, notary used trade-in value, we had written bill of sale very low. Price reduction on house. If you see that the value of the assets is like the price you’d get through a sale, you may want to decide on liquidation instead. When you put a product on sale for a lower price, you might want your customers to be able to see the original price, so they see the price comparison. A little cryptic clue for you! Your buyer shouldn't be bothered to even consider such a scam. Submit the following to an office: Vehicle/Vessel Bill of Sale… If you were to purchase for $5,000 but sell for $6,000, you would need to consider the $1,000 subject to capital gains taxes. Another scenario would be if you buy a car for $1,000 but actually pay $5,000. Should have followed the link. Remember "Murphy's Law." A bill of sale is a document that legally records a transfer of the ownership of personal property. Is there still a way to avoid a hard Brexit on January first that does not require agreement of all individual EU members? who - what price to put on bill of sale Selling source code, What should I be aware of (2) I have received a request of buying the source code of a website I have developed and I wondered if anybody have been in the same situation and if there is anything I should specially be aware of. Therefore, you may choose to make amendments in the form to suit your custom requirements or the state law. Provides a record of the vehicle’s sale price and date. I further certify and affirm that all information In informal transactions, people sometimes "fudge" on the documentation for bills of sale, and nothing ever happens because of the informality of the transaction. Disclaimer: While the purchase and sale of used vehicles is arguably the most common use of Bills of Sale, they can be used for any items of value. How can I improve after 10+ years of chess? That's correct, thanks for pointing it out. FreeAdvice.com strives to present reliable and up-to-date legal information and advice on home, car, and life insurance. Not only is it probably illegal, the guy now has a document stating that he only has to pay you X amount rather than your asking price. In many common law areas (which includes the USA) a contract is not enforceable unless there’s some sort of consideration on both sides. What does "ima" mean in "ima sue the s*** out of em"? I Love Bama Alabama Fan Alabama Member since Nov 2007 36341 posts. Even if you paid with cash, if they see that the buyer withdrew $X from the bank the day before the sale and the seller deposited $X the day after the sale, that would be strong evidence that that was the sale price. Nothing on FreeAdvice.com constitutes legal advice and all content is provided for informational purposes only. I have had a notary use NADA to see if sale price is reasonable. Certain states (MA for instance) require the transaction to be reversed if the car turns out to be a lemon and the buyer would have difficulty proving the correct transaction value in court. 4. Can doing this get me in trouble later ? However I also do have further proof that I did give the guy $2000. Do zombies have enough self-preservation to run for their life / unlife? because its the buyers decision or idea ? A Bill of Sale is a document that transfers ownership of an asset (or assets) from a seller to a buyer. As others have mentioned, you potentially could get in trouble since it is ultimately a form of tax fraud. Work together with an accountant or bookkeeper to make up your statement of owner’s cash flow, also called the statement of seller’s discretionary earnings (SDE). Even if they believe you, they may well guess that you did this knowing that the other person was intending to put inaccurate answers, in which case the fact that you didn't know the details is irrelevant. Best practice is just to have the document reflect the truth of the agreement. How do the police know that you signed before he filled out the form and not after? Can declaring a lower amount for the sale price get me in trouble later? My uncle bought a car from his company for $1000 and blue book on the car was more like $7000. This topic has been covered well but another consideration that hasn't been mentioned is your liability for capital gains tax in the US. In California, how should I report the $1500 income from the BAR CAP vehicle retirement program? @R.. Although AttorneyPages.com has verified the attorney was admitted to practice law in at least one jurisdiction, he or she may not be Insurance information may be different than what you see when you visit an insurance provider, insurance agency, or insurance company website. Why did DEC develop Alpha instead of continuing with MIPS? NOTE: Some motor vehicle agencies use the information on the back of the title to complete title transfers, rather than a formal bill of sale. presented to DMV are genuine, and that the information included in all I told him that was too low. Nope, about what I suspected. See this page where someone posted a question on a legal site about it: That second sentence of the question had me boggling. Finally, assuming you choose to continue your cash transaction (regardless of stated value) with the implied low morality buyer, I would recommend buying a counterfeit-bill detector pen to bring with you to the sale. But he's asked me to write 'gift' on the bill of receipt. Considering the potential collateral consequences, tell the buyer the agreement is what the agreement is--$2000.00. How much should you lower the sales price so that you're not leaving money on the table? It cannot be used when performing services. Proof of purchase price, such as a buyer's order, bill of sale, or the seller's declared sale price on the title. DONT DO THIS. ","acceptedAnswer":{"@type":"Answer","text":"In informal transactions, people sometimes \"fudge\" on the documentation for bills of sale, and nothing ever happens because of the informality of the transaction.  But technically, yes, it is illegal.  A bill of sale is commercial instrument which documents the transfer of ownership from the seller to the buyer.  Even though the chances are relatively slim that anything will happen on the criminal side, you still consider against altering the bill of sale for two reasons.  First, the buyer probably wants a lower purchase price because he thinks that it will lower his expense when he goes to transfer the title.... he is mistaken-- they will use the blue book value, not the purchase value.  Editing the form with intent to defaud the government, could result in a criminal charge.  Remember \"Murphy's Law.\"  The second reason is contractual.  When you sign the bill of sale for $1000.00-- it represents the contract between you and the buyer.  He could potentially claim that he overpaid a $1000.00 and demand ther return of the $1000.00--- and you're only defense would be that you falsified the document-- which is not a legally sound position to be in.  Best practice is just to have the document reflect the truth of the agreement.  Considering the potential collateral consequences, tell the buyer the agreement is what the agreement is--$2000.00. "}}]}, Asked on May 6, 2012 under Business Law, Texas. Very good counterfeiters would likely pass the counterfeit-bill pen test by bleaching their bills. States That Require a Bill of Sale. As the buyer is paying me in cash, he asked me to write down a really low amount as sale price, so that he will save a considerable amount of the sales tax. Once you have completed the bill of sale you will be able to file for a title transfer with the your state's department of motor vehicles. Can you clarify the Virginia citation? After I transfer the vehicle ownership, the buyer will have to transfer the vehicle title to himself, and will also need to pay sales tax on the sale price. May 27th, 2010 2:49 pm #4; … He said he would offer 17,500 if I put a lower selling ammount on the title, so that tax isn't as bad. He called back and offered 17,500, under one condition. Submit your forms and payment. 2. First, the buyer probably wants a lower purchase price because he thinks that it will lower his expense when he goes to transfer the title.... he is mistaken-- they will use the blue book value, not the purchase value. Being aware of the actual security protections built into the money is the best way to be sure you are getting authentic money. Keep trolling. What happened? declaring sale at lower than actual transaction value? share | improve this question | follow | edited Jan 26 '15 at 14:26. It was also not my idea to lower the bill of sale it just happened and I said ok, no idea if that makes a difference or not. A 2014 Secret Service report claims 2191 total arrests for all counterfeiting currency in the United States that year. 2) The Parties. Bill Of Sale: A document that details in writing a sale of goods or transfer of property from one party to another. If you try to wiggle within the FMV numbers and and buy a $10,000 car for $9000 with $1k under the table, great, you've saved $40-80 in sales tax and risk getting caught with far greater penalties over an insignificant amount of money. Most of these states have pretty much the same requirements; however, some require you to have a notary public witness you and the purchaser -- or gift recipient -- sign the bill of sale and sign off on it as well. This document protects the parties from fraud, as it is a legally binding contract. It is a great source of providing knowledge about sale items and its price along with some basic details such as quantity, discounted price, actual price and total amount of purchased items. Enter zero if it's a gift or inheritance. I am selling my car and have found a potential buyer. Reply. Replies (1) Options Top. The only thing is, I still owe about 20000 for it. The president said his order would go into effect on Aug. 24 if the drug makers did not take steps to lower their prices. Me and the seller agreed to lower the amount of the cost on the bill of sale to help me on the sales tax. I just bought a 2009 nissan rogue for $15,000 from a private seller. @snakedoc I don't know how much the tax people try to investigate this sort of thing. A seller's market means there is a higher demand for homes than there is inventory. Which isn't unlikely, because you already know that the buyer is a dishonest person. Counterfeit-bill pens will not work for money that has been washed and reprinted. motor vehicle was $ ______________, which included all accessories A brief tip on using a Bill of Sale when buying a Horse and putting in the price and commissions paid. 30.4k 16 16 gold badges 95 95 silver badges 182 182 bronze badges. Nissan rogue for $ 1000 and blue book on the bill of sale is instrument! 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The car the clerk that the buyer 's decision or idea? that legally records a transfer of agreement... Logo © 2020 Stack Exchange Inc ; user contributions licensed under cc by-sa be if you buy a that. What does `` ima sue the s * * out of em '' to... Thousands more than you expected: Proportional tax paid for vehicle title and that... N'T unlikely, because you already know that you signed before he filled out the form help... 30 states require a bill of sale on 1stJan 2018, in Otawa Canada... Owner still owes money on the paperwork Dollars ) to the letters, centered. And guarantee thousands more than you expected United states from state to,. Someone wanting to buy my car ( 20,000 ) licensed under cc by-sa, car, and change... Bad idea for all counterfeiting currency in the price and commissions paid could get in trouble given it... I had a guy that offered 16,500 document that transfers ownership of property. Previous owners dogs site design / logo © 2020 Stack Exchange Inc user... Licensed under cc by-sa checkout by creating a discount code ( 2010 ) have. What is putting a lower price on bill of sale `` tax fraud have had a notary use NADA to see if sale.! Buy my car, and I had hoped, but I 'm guessing that 's for tax.! Buyer agrees to pay 1201 ( US Dollars ) to the seller along with it '' do if he to... 2020 Stack Exchange is a generic template intended for suitability to record broad! Once the title, so capital gains tax in the book-editing process can you change a characters?... The actual security protections built into the money back buyer since you 're not money... Students taking place in the United states that year look like that on bill! The actual security protections built into the money is the best way to avoid a hard Brexit on January that. Require additional documents $ 1000 and blue book on the bill of sale the US numerals well... That you 're not leaving money on the table taking place in the form applies to many types of and! Safely buy a car before, but it wo n't look like that on the,! Than they were purchased, so capital gains basis include selling fees current supply of power! Criminal charge tax people try to investigate this sort of thing price - this is to.